Q&A with Shaun Nua

In our sit down with ASU’s new defensive line coach, we discussed the state of the position going into spring practice, how the defensive line functions in a 3-3-5 scheme, establishing the Polynesian recruiting pipeline and why a recruiting trip to Hawaii isn’t all it’s cracked up to be.

Devils Digest: Newcomer Jermayne Lole is somebody you got to know during the recruiting process. What defensive lineman do you expect him to be?

Nua: “Yes, yes, I was very happy we got Jermayne. It’s all, first and foremost, it starts off with his mindset. The kid has a purpose of what he does, both on and off the field, he knows exactly what he wants to do in life. But I love the way he plays the game. He’s somebody that’s very versatile, that could play all three positions up front. I know you look at him and you’re like, ‘He’s a little small,’ but he’s 270. It’s these Polynesian kids, they look light but they’re heavy. Yeah, so I’m very excited about Jermayne, I’m very happy we got Jermayne, and people tried to come after him there at the end but I’m happy for him.”

Devils Michael Matus is player that signed in December and wasn’t recruited by you, but what do you think he brings to the table?

Nua: “Well, I don’t know much about Michael, I haven’t even met him yet, but he’s a great player, he’s a great player, that’s why ASU offered him and stuff. The thing is, he’ll fit exactly what we do, his size and everything, he’ll fit exactly what we do. I’m interested to learn more about his personality and him as a person, I haven’t had the opportunity to do that, so I’m excited to get to know him more. But he’ll fit right in.”

Devils Digest: As a defensive line coach, just talk about the philosophy of having three linemen versus in the 3-3-5. What are the challenges, what are the advantages?

Nua: “I think that’s the biggest misconception…we will always end up with four linemen. But, like you said, disadvantage is taking one D-lineman out and having lesser guys. I played in this system, coach Gonzales used to work for Bronco Mendenhall at BYU. I was a junior and senior under Bronco Mendenhall. So, I played in it, I’m familiar with it. Really, some of the things you’ve got, just the body size, you want a little bit bigger guys, quick twitch, don’t have to drop much, but people can see that they do sometimes.

“Compared to a 4-3 where you have to speed guys up on the edge, a medium-sized 3-technique, and a big nose tackle. This is, you’ve got three guys that can all push the pocket. The hope is, all three of them are interchangeable. They can play inside, outside and we’ll slide them here and there to make it work. Disadvantages and advantages, that’s just probably the biggest one’s just size. 245-pound defensive end compared to a 220-pound defensive end that’s still probably a linebacker.”

Devils Digest: Is that often a misnomer, that a 3-3-5 must have a huge 300-pound guy in the middle playing nose tackle?

Nua: “That’s not the case. In a 3-4, you probably do have to have that big guy in the middle. 3-3-5, they’re all moving, they’re moving somewhere. Left, right, middle, or they drop. So, they’ve got to be able to do all that, that’s why we’re not big on getting a really big nose because then that’s all he can play is the nose. Unless he’s really, really special at going forward. So, it’s a defense that’s versatile enough to do all that.”

Devils Digest: How much of a chance did you have to take look at the returning defensive linemen? From what you have seen so far, what are some of the things that really jumped out at you?

Nua: “Oh, I’m excited. The one thing that jumps out is the lack of experience. We lost the guys with a lot of experience. I don’t think, just from the film, that they rotated a lot. So, what happens with that is the guys that we have coming back, it’s lack of experience. But, it’s okay, that’s not that big of a deal, we’re just going to make sure that spring practice they got a lot of reps, so that way, they can see as many types of blocks coming their way, and then the expectations of effort that we’re going to require from them.”

Devils Digest: It seems like sometimes when players get a new position coach there’s a new level of energy in the room, have you felt that so far?

Nua: “My worry’s not the energy right now, my hope is that the energy continues on and on, stays consistent for a long time. So, I’m excited, but I’m not overly excited. I want to make sure that this thing is built to last. I feel the good energy, I feel like I have a good group coming back.”

Devils Digest: I know that one guy that a lot of people are looking forward to who didn’t play because he transferred last year was Darius Slade. Whether it’s watching his practice film or when he played at Ohio State, what have been your first impressions of him?

Nua: “Good-looking, good-looking player. But more impressive, the thing that stood out more is how he is attacking the workouts we have. He’s already bought in, he’s already helped us with some of the recruits that we’ve had coming in. So, I haven’t really watched any film on him, to be honest, which is good, because I want to start from scratch. I want to see what he has in the workout. I’m very, very excited about his potential.”

Devils Digest: What are your impressions of D.J. Davidson who redshirted last year?

Nua: “The size. The size and he can move for that size (6-5 306 lbs.). Now, just watching him in workout stuff, even he knows he’s got to be more consistent. But we all do, we need that consistency. I am so excited about D.J. He’s still a baby. But a big baby that can move really well. Got to get him ready to go.”

Devils Digest: And another player I wanted to talk about is Renell Wren…

Nua: “Isn’t that kid a beast?!”

Devils Digest: Yes, but this is one of those situations where everybody’s saying: ‘Okay, is this the breakout year?’ And it’s his senior year, so, what are your impressions of him?

Nua: “I don’t know why he hasn’t been breaking out yet, I can’t even explain it. I’ve watched him run, he has everything. So, it’s my job to make sure that this is his breakout year. Help him in any way possible, because he has every tool possible — size, speed, even conditioning. You watch him run, he can run all day, so there’s no excuse. If he doesn’t break out, you can blame me.”

Devils Digest: You talked about losing guys like Tashon Smallwood and JoJo Wicker. But you are excited about taking these players and really molding them?

Nua: “I’m excited about what we have coming back, because of the potential. But I’ve also been in this profession long enough to know potential is not always a good thing. So, I’m excited, but not super excited, which I’d rather be than not excited at all or not happy with what we have coming back. I’m pleased with what’s coming back. Now’s our chance and our turn to put it to good use.”

Devils Digest: Just out of curiosity, regarding the 3-3-5 scheme, I don’t think there are any Pac-12 teams that even run a variation of that scheme…

Nua: “I don’t think there’s a lot of teams in the country that run it.”

Devils Digest: So, even though teams will obviously are going to watch film on ASU, maybe go back and watch San Diego State film probably for the first few weeks of the season. Yet, do you feel that the ASU defense will still have some kind of element of surprise?

Nua: “Coach Gonzales put it the best way possible: A lot of people make a big deal out of a 3-3-5, but it’s such a flexible concept that he puts together that, I mean, what happens if you have four really good linemen and two linebackers, then you have to go to a 4-2, which, people don’t know but it could be easily done. It’s very versatile in that way. Plus, it might be a surprise for some offenses, and I hope it is a surprise, but at the same time, it’s not that big of a difference from what people think.”

Devils Digest: Generally speaking does a 3-3-5 lend itself better against a spread offense versus a pro-style offense like USC and Stanford? Do you have to make changes with run-heavy schemes?

Nua: “We can put five d-linemen up there. That’s the beauty of it, and the way coach Gonzales explained it, I was like, ‘Yes, I love it!’ So, it (3-3-5) has a very good flexibility and versatility for it to adjust to those, and it’s all going to come down to who plays harder and who has the best fundamentals and leverage. So, you know, the scheme is sometimes overrated.”

Devils Digest: Now the thing is when you play Stanford and USC, it’s a battle in the trenches on every down. However, those teams huddle, so you can rotate linemen. So, while it’s more of a physical challenge for the defensive line to face an offense like that perhaps you would prefer to play those teams more than others because you can keep your linemen fresh?

Nua: “Yes, you have time to rotate, you’re not trying to guess if the referee’s going to give you time to rotate. Now you’re in NFL style, you huddle up, figure out what personnel they have, you put your personnel and it’s just smash-mouth football. They know it, we know it, and that’s the beauty of it.”

Devils Digest: Now most of the Pac-12 teams are going to be in the same boat you are, not being able to rotate defensive linemen when somebody’s running a no-huddle offense. Therefore, how much of an impact is it for defensive line coaches to go in with that mindset such as, ‘Okay, I’m playing Washington State or UCLA and I’m just not going to be able to rotate defensive linemen…’

Nua: “Not a lot, because if they’re going so fast, then that means their O-Line is not changing, too. So, their gas tank is probably at the same level. But we have the advantage, because if one of their guys subs, the ref gives us time to sub. So, if I see a receiver coming out, I’m going to change it up and get fresher guys in there. Or, at the same time, if we have three dogs that can play as long as possible at a very high level, they’re going to stay in.”

Devils Digest: In all your years coaching at Navy, what are some of the biggest lessons you took away from being in that program, which is so different than the clear majority of programs in the country?

Nua: “Consistency. Discipline. Accountability. And then, probably most importantly is the love that those guys have for what they do. The motivation they have to do what they do comes from within them and I’ve learned that. You have that chemistry, coaches especially in the game of football, you talk about the military, those guys are sacrificing so much more than you could imagine.

“So, to have that coming in, our job is just to make sure that they channel that energy towards the right way, and that’s why I believe coach (Ken) Niumatalolo over there is doing a great job. And even all the other academies, they find a really good way to motivate those guys. That’s what I learned a lot, is the unselfishness those guys have for not only each other but for that place.”

Devils Digest: When you coach at a service academy, do you not need to worry about being tough on your players because they’re already plenty tough on themselves?

Nua: “You have to kick them out of the weight room. You have to make sure that they don’t go swim an extra 100 miles because they have to pass their (physical) test. It’s almost the opposite. Now, you still have a couple kids that you have to push to get that work ethic, but for the majority of the time, those guys after practice, they’re putting weight vests on and making sure they’re not falling way too behind from their companies within the military status.

“It’s crazy. Their mindset, they’re wired differently. You’re talking about guys going into the Marines, Navy SEALs, those are the kind of kids that I have so much respect for.”

Devils Digest: Is it true that there’s like a size limit for the linemen in the service academies?

Nua: “They used to have it, but now… it’s not like they say you could go get whoever you want. In order for you to graduate from that place, you have to pass the PRT (Physical Readiness Test), the swimming and all the pull-ups and push-ups stuff they have. You need to run a mile and a half in 10 minutes and 30 seconds, and if you’re a 300-pounder, you’ll never get it done. So, before we recruit a kid there and if we see he’s 320 lbs. and he’ll never get down to 270 to run that, we’re not going to recruit him. And if he’s really, really big but we think he has the work ethic and the drive to get down, we’ll recruit him. That’s why after the last bowl game their senior year, they go meet with the nutritionist and drop 50, 60, 70 pounds so they could pass it (PRT). It’s not a weight restriction anymore like it used to, but there’s still some common-sense stuff that we couldn’t bring just anybody there.”

Devils Digest: I’m not saying coaching football is easy, but to some extent is it possibly easier to work at a place like Navy than a program that’s not a service academy, just because of the built-in culture of character and discipline at a service academy?

Nua: “I think it’s harder over there (at Navy), because of those restrictions and limitations. Now, if you’re talking about the discipline side of things, that part is probably a little easier, but to try and go against Notre Dame every year and you’re playing with guys that are worried about their physics and chemistry exams while they have military obligations, now that’s a really, really tough job to do.

“Over here (at ASU), it’s football, academics, football, academics, over there it’s football, academics, military. And the thought of them, when are they going to serve in the military after they graduate? You have to be a counselor — well, you have to do that with every school, but over there you have to make sure you get to these kids’ hearts. I guess there are pluses and minuses, there are some difficult parts and there are some hard parts.”

Devils Digest: You’ve experienced different head coaches that you’ve worked with and played for, how does Herm Edwards compare in terms of his personality?

Nua: “Oh my god, the energy. The energy he has and his focus on doing stuff the right way is just amazing. He worries more about developing these guys, these kids into really good men, and helping them become better men. Because a lot of them are really good young men already, but when you get him in the football meeting room, and we talk X’s and O’s, I got a front-row seat of learning a lot of good stuff.

“I’m very, very blessed, I’m lucky, I’m fortunate to be in this position because he is a very smart and competitive man. So, I’m very excited, and that’s a great combination, having a good character man with a very competitive spirit and wants to do things the right way, I can’t ask for anything better.”

Devils Digest: I must think that his military background is probably something that might be easier for you to deal with compared to other assistants...

Nua: “It’s easy. When you have guys that are all focused on the same thing of getting better, it’s easy to get along. You talk about coach White and coach G, they came together from the same place, all they want to do is win. And then you have Antonio Pierce coming in, this guy attacks recruiting like it’s the NFL like he’s still playing. He’s aggressive, he’s passionate about it, and I’m learning a lot from these guys. It’s not hard getting along with people that you have the same common goals, you know what I mean? It’s been a blast for me and I’m enjoying every moment.”

Devils Digest: You talk about recruiting and with Shaun Nua on board everybody is saying: ‘Okay, here come the Polynesian players to ASU’ but I believe that literally, every team in the Pac-12 and really in the western region has a Polynesian coach on staff...

Nua: “We’re behind the 2019 class, you get there and they’ve had relationships with Joe Salave’a at Oregon, with Ikaika Malloe at Washington… but you get the point, all these guys have two years at least. So, when I go to a Polynesian kid’s family, they already have two-year relationships with those guys. I’m not saying I’m backing out, I’m still going to challenge them for these recruits. But the point is, yes, there’s a lot of good Polynesian kids out there, but I’m not here to get Polynesian kids only. I’m here to get the best players possible to help us. So, I’m excited, there’s a lot of good Polynesians out there.”

Devils Digest: It seems like a big concentration of such players in Utah because of the

LDS church. Could that be an advantage for schools like Arizona State which are closer to Utah compared to Oregon and Washington?

Nua: “Yeah, that is a good advantage, but winning is still the best advantage. You want to get recruits here, you’ve got to get good players here. Good players want to go where they win, so it all comes down to winning.”

Devils Digest: In January we all you saw you on Twitter already hitting up Hawaii on the recruiting trail. Tough gig, but I guess it’s something you had to deal with...

Nua: “Listen, it’s not as glamorous as you think because that’s a long flight, man. It’s a long six hours sitting on that flight. And I recruited Hawaii from Navy, I got more than 12 kids to Navy from Hawaii. So, I’m not going to ask for a first-class ticket, I’m just saying it’s not as glamorous, but it’s still a beautiful island, a beautiful place. Very good players come out of there, but we’re going to try and channel our recruiting to wherever the players are.”

Devils Digest: Is it feasible to recruit American Samoa?

Nua: “Very hard. Because of a lot of different reasons, the distance, the military requirements and the academics, I didn’t go to Samoa as much. But now that I’m closer, I want to make sure that we don’t miss any good players out of there. It’s feasible, but it’s going to take some creativity because there are only two flights that go to Samoa, Monday and Friday. So, if I go Monday, I’m going to spend the whole week there to come back Friday. If I go Friday, school’s out, you get there Friday night there’s no school, and you’re not allowed to go anywhere on Sundays. So, it’s really going to have to be a very creative plan, and I’m trying to figure out what the best plan is.”

Devils Digest: Speaking of plans, if you had a to-do list for spring practice for the defensive line, what would be your top goals to get accomplished?

Nua: “Make sure that they understand the standard, the expectation of the mindset that we want them to have in every practice. I don’t care if they’re running the right way, wrong way, I want to make sure that they are working their butts off. I want them to understand that that’s the culture that we need to develop.

“And then make sure they run the right way. And then I want to make sure that I come out of this spring break with a good depth. I want to make sure that I develop a good depth and make sure to go into fall camp knowing who my 1’s, my 2’s and my 3’s are. So, that’s kind of the plan, and obviously, we have smaller plans on how to get that, but we’re excited for spring.”

Note: Jeff Griffith contributed to this article

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